[Feedback] Most heists feel too Linear - randomize heists

04 Aug, '23
Adam Merged

So when we saw the fingerprints on the same buttons we tried the same keycode as before and it worked. So we did not have to check the actual keycode on the computer screen in the office or wherever. This opens up ways to cheese the game, when you just get to know the keycode in the first attempt, remember the code and use it instantly on the next try. Just do it the same as with the colored switches.

I don't know if this is the case, but of course only have totally random keypad. You should not be able to guess the code from a previous game.

04 Aug, '23
Cocomancien Merged

I had the impression, after restarting like 10 times a heist that everything was always the same (same switch color, same QR code placement, same room placements, same guard spawn etc)

1

05 Aug, '23
Adam Merged

Haha yes, I got totally fooled by the switch thing, I guess I didnt get that I started a new game and thats why the switch was another colour

05 Aug, '23
Jump Merged

@ Cocomancien
Yes that is the point, so that when you struggle you know where everything is.
This post is about beeing able to skip certain things (like hacking to know which switch)
Which I agree should still be randomized every time

05 Aug, '23
Maxfun196 Merged

After restarting the heist from the start menu in-game, everything is the same place, even the safe code is the same.

05 Aug, '23
Rokkrwolf Merged

The level should randomize if the players vote to restart or fail the mission and restart. Currently, it just starts the level with the same layout.

05 Aug, '23
Vis Merged

Since heists now have seeds, you can get to the point of learning the code, restart the heist and use the same code on the vault door, because of that the heist can be completed without even masking up

06 Aug, '23
Snaex Admin Merged

"[Feedback] No rest for the wicked code abuse" (suggested by Vis on 2023-08-05), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

06 Aug, '23
Snaex Admin Merged

"Heist doesn't re-randomize when restarted" (suggested by Maxfun196 on 2023-08-05), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

06 Aug, '23
Dorn Merged

Hello everyone.

I noticed that the mission doesn't change when you restart a round. By that I mean that the vault code, camera positions and guards will remain the same. So if I've gotten to Manager Phase and know the code and the color of the cable and I then restart the round, I can do everything in Civi mode because I know the code and color. I can bypass the retina scan because I know the code. it says access denied but the code is correct and the vault opens.

My suggestion for improvement:
Randomize the heist
Or that the keypad on the Vault is only activated after a successful retina scan.

I hope you could read this to some extent. Unfortunately English is not my main language.

Best regards
Dorn

06 Aug, '23
ThePaulineIndex Merged

On the beta map the vault is *always* in the same place, so much so that even just one day of playing made the map feel very samey for replayability. Every loud attempt (hard to test stealth with enforced public lobbies) is *always* open vault > move bags to the corner utility room > move bags to ally> move bags to van.

The small variance in van location doesn't really change it up because the static map layout outside makes the alley *always* the best place to move bags for both locations. The variable server/cam/closet/bathroom helps a bit but it's small potatoes in the flow of the map, especially since they are irrelevant if the heist goes loud, see: https://payday3.featureupvote.com/suggestions/470298/feedback-stealth-loud-map-progress-loss-feels-like-wasted-potential.

Please consider returning to or even amping up the map variance compared to PD2. We were sold on the smaller number of maps on them being higher quality, other than visually - I'm not really feeling that.

07 Aug, '23
Snaex Admin Merged

"[Bug] Manager part skip" (suggested by Dorn on 2023-08-06), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

07 Aug, '23
Snaex Admin Merged

"[FEEDBACK]Randomization after restart" (suggested by Rokkrwolf on 2023-08-05), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

08 Aug, '23
Salem Merged

In the beta, RNG is determined when the lobby is created. That means that all objectives will remain in the same location when you restart, and even the vault code doesn't change.
While this was good in the beta for learning purposes, this eventually makes the game easier/more stale as you don't have to adapt every time you restart. It even leads to players bruteforcing the code or remembering it from a previous try, skipping entirely the retinal scanner objective and completing the heist without masking up (which is cool but probably unintended).

What I suggest:
- Change all the RNG after a restart like it is in Payday 2.
- Add an optional modifier/mutator when you create a lobby that allows it to have a fixed RNG seed even after restarts (ideally it could bring a menu to select RNG like the RNG Modifier mod does in Payday 2). However you cannot gain any reward or progress towards challenges in that mode. This would help speedrunners and players that are still learning the map a

10 Aug, '23
Snaex Admin Merged

"[Feedback] Random Seed + Speedrun Mode" (suggested by Salem on 2023-08-08), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

09 Sep, '23
RedFire Merged

I feel like its too easy when the rng doesn't change at all when you restart the heist was that an intentional game design or just as mistake ? i know that you can restart the hole lobby to get other rng but its weird

13 Sep, '23
Snaex Admin Merged

"[Feedback] please make rng mix every restart" (suggested by RedFire on 2023-09-09), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

21 Sep, '23
RedFlower Merged

Currently after matching into a server the randomization seems set. This makes it possible to skip chunks of heist as you can know what the codes for doors and items are as well as knowing where spawns are for key items.

This means failures are less punishing and for bad spawns instead of just retrying some groups may completely rematch.

22 Sep, '23
BFrenki Merged

I can see that if I start a level and then vote restart the level is EXACTLY the same (phones, info, objectives,...) everything is on the same place.

22 Sep, '23
Mr.Colin Merged

When you vote to restart a heist all the codes, keycard spawns, and any other random aspect will be the same as the last attempt. This causes really easy cheesing and removes the random aspects that make a heist more enjoyable to replay. I suggest that they should be randomized even after a vote restart.

25 Sep, '23
Snaex Admin

"Re-Randomize Heist Layout on Failure" (suggested by RedFlower on 2023-09-21), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

25 Sep, '23
Snaex Admin

"[Feedback] Restarting Heist should not keep the same seed" (suggested by Mr.Colin on 2023-09-22), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

26 Sep, '23
Bionic Merged

It would be good after reset, the map stays the same, but the codes and items change.

27 Sep, '23
Snaex Admin Merged

"More random" (suggested by BFrenki on 2023-09-22), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

27 Sep, '23
Oskilled Merged

I do enjoy that the seed stays with a restart. Even if i fail (Stealth or loud) i have made some progress for the next try.

27 Sep, '23
B Lior Merged

Being able to gather info from previous tries makes the sealth easy as hell. Payday 2 restart system is way better.

17 Oct, '23
Snaex Admin Merged

"[Feedback] Heist reset" (suggested by Bionic on 2023-09-26), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

18 Oct, '23
Snaex Admin Merged

"Re roll every random element on restart." (suggested by B Lior on 2023-09-27), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

18 Oct, '23
762s Merged

Randomize the hesit codes/spawns/etc. with a restart!

05 Nov, '23
nanaisu Merged

Post-beta, there is still a pretty large lack of variation in heists. It would be nice to see multiple different locations of banks and layouts, much like in PAYDAY 2. It would be a great way to increase replayability without spending a ton of time and effort on building new heists. I believe that in Road Rage, it's one of the least replayable maps because there is essentially only one layout. I think that an "Armored Transport DLC" type scenario would work very well here to increase the replayability of already existing heists.
One thing I think PAYDAY 2 does better by a large margin is it re-uses assets and maps very well. Seeing clever re-use of assets and maps in PAYDAY 3 would be great as well.

16 Nov, '23
Snaex Admin

"[Feedback] Have totally random keypad codes (randomize the heist at restart)" (suggested by Adam on 2023-08-04), including upvotes (66) and comments (23), was merged into this suggestion.

17 Jan, '24
Kotti

Absolutely the number 1 thing that keeps me from playing any more. Payday 2's greatest strength was that randomization on reset forced you to pay attention on every attempt and properly learn the heists, without it heists quickly turn into mindless excercises in repetition.

1

17 Jan, '24
BW125 Merged

Every heist feels basically the same every time, with few random elements like keycard spawns or a room being in one of two places.

There should be multiple ways to complete objectives, or objectives that might not even occur. Different guard spawns, patrol routes, behaviors, etc. Instead of the same 'wait in this circle to hack the thing' objective, have a little minigame we need to complete that's different each time, or just have different ways to complete the objective, even if it's just 'hack this thing.'

Don't even get me started on the fact we only have three different security modifiers. Cerberus core only shows up in like two maps, so all the other maps just have armored cams and the lead guard (which could also use a rework).

They touted the game as having so many random elements and variety in the heists, when in actuality the first payday feels like it vastly outperforms this one in that area, which is saying something.

17 Jan, '24
watssssson Merged

Do you guys remember GO bank? The Armored Transport heists? Even the regular Harvest & Trustee bank heists? Remember the random events that came with it? "Bulldozer in the truck!" on the Armored Transports, a gate blocking your way into the fault with Houston going "Oh fuck..." on H&T, or that VERY small chance of the vault already being open on GO Bank? What ever happened to that? I really wish they'd add back in random events into the heists in PD3, give it that replayability that made PD2 so good, imo. Why not add a random dozer in one of the crates of 99 Boxes? Or a chance of pressure-tiles spawning that when stepped on release gas into the room in the real Uma Ladette room? Or lasers being put in the vault room of Gold & Sharke that'll sound the alarm in Stealth? Sharke's one sneaky b*tch after all, she'd want to have that server hidden. It's stuff like that I'd like in Payday 3, and I think would work wonders for reaplayability in the game, only for all heists, if possible. :)

18 Jan, '24
Peves Merged

Although there are a few things in the levels as they currently are that randomize it just doesn't quite feel random enough. Payday 2 was so replayable due to how random everything was when you started a level over. I think although payday 3 has some random stuff it just isn't quite enough.
Maybe randomize gold bars into the deposit boxes, or add gold as a loot option in the banks. Maybe add some heavy and rare artifacts to the Surphaze Gallery. Once in a while when you launch into it maybe the Artifacts will spawn you can leave with some heavy valuable loot, much like the blood diamond in Diamond Heist.

More importantly shuffle rooms around more.

1

19 Jan, '24
Snaex Admin

"RNG/ Random Events; Replayability on the Limited Heist Selection (PD3)" (suggested by <Hidden> on 2024-01-17), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

19 Jan, '24
Snaex Admin

"Level Randomization for more replayability" (suggested by <Hidden> on 2024-01-18), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

19 Jan, '24
mwg

I am extremely surprised that this "randomize-feature" is not in the top 5 suggestions. I am absolutely sure, that this is one of the by far biggest and one of the key problems that PD3 has.

Imagine you play chess against a computer - there are 8 levels - and he always plays the same figures in the same order. Some levels are tough, but after a short while you get it. After you got it you're done and you don't need to replay the levels again. This is Payday 3.

20 Jan, '24
zander Merged

the heists are really predictable id rather enemies be sent in more randomly. that or add a AI director to spice up heists. really anything to shake up the way each mission plays

22 Jan, '24
BackAlleyJim Merged

Making "alternate approach" styles for the maps youve already created. For example how about breaking in to Bank at night?
How about stealing from the art gallery when its full of people in the viewing rooms
How about different things to steal from different areas of the storage facility
etc etc.
Put the assets to work dont let them go to waste.

You could also use the assets to quickly build a bunch of smaller "quick heists" that feature the same style play like jewelry store or small bank, but just different layouts using the same assets.

I think we need lots of maps/environments but reusing a lot of the assets so we dont have to use 500 gigs of HD space

22 Jan, '24
Snaex Admin

"more RNG per hiest" (suggested by <Hidden> on 2024-01-20), including upvotes (1) and comments (0), was merged into this suggestion.

23 Jan, '24
urivan Merged

add randomness and variants to the levels like in payday 2 it cannot be that you die in a run in stealth and the next run all the cards, VIP civilians, passwords, cables to cut, etc. are the same, you feel like a cheater entering through the main entrance of the bank and in 2 minutes I am in the vault, THERE ARE EVEN ACHIEVEMENTS FOR THAT this approach kills the stealth experience

23 Jan, '24
Uberosh Merged

Game currently has one big problem, the interaction with maps & gameplay. Unlike predecessor, every map in game lacks the elements which makes each playthrough different. For example take The Diamond (with random tiles in final room), or Go Bank which has certain chance for random event. Not tellin for the famous Shadow Raid.
You guys took the power and opportunities of new popular engine, but don't utilize it - this is really sad, so much could be done... for example random events during mission like return of cash collector's truck which adds guards on level,

23 Jan, '24
Jakob Kabob Merged

Payday 2 heists felt like i could play them 1000 times each and never get bored due to it's rng. Examples like having different escapes, different camera placements, objectives sometimes going south and objective items like keycards were scattered thoroughly. Some great examples are the different escapes you can get in Scarface Heists (the boat or the 2 different van positions), the Go Bank sewer maze entrance being in different spots making the maze feel new each time, and the chance of c4 being in the basement in Counterfeit. Some more basic examples like the money pallets in Birth of Sky and the c4 placement in Golden Grin Casino are still great to have. Some specific improvements i can think of for payday 3 would be the vault in No Rest for the Wicked and Gold & Sharke, the manager's office in Rock the Cradle, the bedroom and vault room position in Touch the Sky, bile's spawn point in Under the Surphaze and the layout of the server room in Syntax Error.

24 Jan, '24
urivan

Sadly, it is not a bug, it is the approach they are looking for in this payday 3 because there are "achievements" of passing certain maps by skipping parts of the stealth, like the bank, there is the achievement of passing it without going to human resources, which is where you should find out the name of the employee with the card. that is not good idea